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it is now time to introduce you to our

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public affairs officer brandy dean and

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our special guest dan gozde who is a

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chemist here at the Johnson Space Center

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so Mission Control I am introduced you

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to st. peter's preparatory high school

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hi thanks so much and welcome to the

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Mission Control here in Houston were in

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the International Space Station flight

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control room and like you said I have

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with me den gazda who is an

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environmental scientist and chemist so

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hopefully I know y'all sent in a few

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questions ahead of time a lot of

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studying chemistry and hopefully he'll

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be able to help you with that but first

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I'm gonna let him tell you a little bit

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about who he is and what he does yes as

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you mentioned my name is Dan gosder I

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work in the human health and performance

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Directorate here at JSC I'm an

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environmental scientist in the water and

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food analytical lab our primary

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responsibilities are supporting the

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environmental health systems and the

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environmental control and life support

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systems on ISS all right well thanks so

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much for joining this team we really

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appreciate it and I guess if y'all want

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to start with your questions now that

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oh um the lady that spoke to us prior to

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you guys she said that on space some

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medals are made that wouldn't be able to

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be made on earth what happens if you

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bring those metals that can only be made

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in space to earth like will they you

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know come apart or something like that

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or what would happen or worthy or with

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nothing happened at all generally

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speaking once you when you're in the

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microgravity environment you're able to

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do things that you can't do in a

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terrestrial laboratory here on earth and

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so with metals you can alloy metals and

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mix them in unique ratios to achieve

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desired properties so you can mix these

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things in space and allow them to form

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with the specific ratios and the alloy

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but once they're formed they should be

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locked into place so they can be

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I was just wondering like how close are

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we to like to sending a community in

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space like in the movie like wall-e like

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where they had a big ship and then go

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like wherever they want how close closer

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than we were several years ago one of

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the exciting things the some of the

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exciting progress we've made in the past

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couple of years is really moving towards

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a closed-loop life support system on the

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space station where we're now recovering

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water from urine and scrubbing the

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atmosphere recovering some water through

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a sub body a process and what this does

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this dramatically reduces our reliance

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on ground supplied resources and does

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move us closer to having the ability to

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sustain a population of folks out in

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space on a long-duration mission without

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having to constantly resupply things

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from the ground and I think I don't know

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necessarily about Wally with all of

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those in great movie we do get a lot of

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inspiration from science fiction and

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occasionally movies right there are a

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lot of folks working at NASA who

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definitely watched a lot of science

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fiction definitely and there are certain

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aspects of science fiction that are more

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realistic than others what materials

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were used in the astronaut suits to

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ensure their safety like I'm guessing

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they have some pretty high end

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insulation because I hear space is

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pretty cold and like also what material

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is used to block radiation because that

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could be pretty dangerous for them out

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there yes I'm not I'm not familiar with

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the exact materials that go into the

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outer shell of the extra vehicular

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mobility units the e/m use those are the

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suits that the astronauts wear during

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during spacewalks or EV a's the extra

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vehicular activities they are

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multi-layer materials so what you have

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is a unique combination of many

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materials stacked on top of each other

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to provide the desired characteristics

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and ensure crew safety during space

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they do have certain materials in the

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suit that reduce the radiation exposure

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but when you're in space the radiation

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exposure is going to be higher than it

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is on the ground I think they also have

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at least in their their gloves heaters

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that helped me keep form you'd asked

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about insulation and it definitely does

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get very cold in space and you

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especially want your hands to be warm

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because you work a lot with your hands

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so to help them keep from getting stiff

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fingers they they have heaters inside

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their gloves yeah they actually have

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some very unique undergarments for the

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spacesuits called liquid cooling and

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ventilation garments that look a lot

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like thermal underwear but they have

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very small diameter tubing that liquid

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circulates through and passes through a

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heat exchanger that helps regulate the

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temperature inside the suits because you

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also get hot in space when the Sun is on

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you so you have to be ready for both

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really really cold temperatures and

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really really hot temperatures hi I'm

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just curious with for instance the space

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station using propulsion systems in

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space since there's not a lot to push

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off of per se how do they work that one

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is probably going to be pretty far

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outside my area of expertise in general

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you do have you have an inertial mass

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from the vehicle itself that you push

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against so there there is a mass to

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overcome there but how the systems

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exactly work is is outside of my area of

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expertise i think we can say that it

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takes a lot less force to move you in

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space just you can see it on the

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International Space Station if you watch

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NASA TV the astronauts can push off with

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just you know a finger and keep going

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for a long time so it takes a lot less

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energy to move at all and so that at

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least helps us getting around in space

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once we've gotten out of the Earth's

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atmosphere which certainly does take a

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lot of thrust yeah once you don't have

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to overcome the gravitational vector you

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can expend a lot less energy moving and

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translating hopefully that helps answer

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your question yeah thanks

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I just got to act because I know that

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they were suits and but with the

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system's itself on the station how do

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you defend against solar flares that

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could also hurt the magnetics within

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those systems or the astronauts

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themselves the all of the systems that

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go up on the space station are tested

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extensively and there are specific

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precautions that are taken to protect

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against ionizing radiation events with

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the the crew themselves there are

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certain instances where you know they

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they locate in certain areas of the

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station occasionally they they locate in

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the water the water storage area because

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water ends up being a great shield for

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radiation so we have large bags of water

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that we use to maintain a contingency

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reserve and sometimes the crew will

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sleep in the proximity of those and we

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basically have space weathermen who let

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us know when there's going to be a lot

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of activity that we want to protect the

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astronauts from so that helps us know

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when we need to maybe get them into an

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area like Dan said that has a little bit

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as intervent environmental scientists

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what is what is one of the most

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interesting side effects of being in

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space i would say that they're probably

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the most interesting aspect of

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maintaining environmental control

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systems in space is the lack of phase

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separation that you have when you're

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outside of the or when you're in a

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microgravity environment so for a water

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system for example which is one of the

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things that I'm the most familiar with

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on the ground you don't get too

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concerned about air bubbles being and

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trapped in the water supply because they

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always rise to the surface well the

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reason the bubbles rise to the surface

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is because the gas is less dense than

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liquid and in a gravitational field it

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moves to the top in the absence of that

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gravitational field all the air bubbles

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stay and trained in the body of the

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liquid and that can pose a lot of

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problems for fluid handling systems I

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was watching something and I read an

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article that there is over the last 60

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or 50 years or so they've been a lot of

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satellites put up in that are just

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floating now in Earth orbit I think the

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number was like this valve 50,000 of

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them and only about 1,000 are actually

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functioning so they deemed those you

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know dead satellites space junk is there

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any like efforts being used to clean it

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up because they do pros a problem

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especially for the International Space

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Station again I'm not aware of efforts I

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know it's definitely something that is

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tracked very closely because folks

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always want to know if any of the the

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orbital debris is going to pose a risk

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to the station right and we have a team

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here on the ground that lets us know if

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there's any debris which is what we call

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it and it's going to get anywhere near

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the space station and if we need to we

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move the space station around to avoid

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it but as far as cleaning up I know

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we're looking into different ideas and

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hopefully you're going to come up with

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an effort just because like you said

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there's there's good it's getting to the

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point where there's so much of it in

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space but a lot of it takes care of

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itself um it all eventually continues to

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lower in orbit and then usually burns up

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in the Earth's atmosphere before it

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falls down so given enough time it'll

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it'll take care of itself but there's so

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much

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of it like you said that we do I want to

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try and find some other way to help out

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with the cleanup effort what new

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chemical discoveries have been made in

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space new chemical discoveries there

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there's a lot of interesting phenomenon

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that have been observed in space a lot

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of them relating to the behavior of

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materials outside of our in the absence

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of gravity there's been a lot of studies

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done on protein crystallization that

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they've seen some very novel

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crystallographic patterns that form in

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the absence of gravity and there's

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probably some of the other things that

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have come about would really be material

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compatibility issues and exposure issues

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that thing's designed for space to an to

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tolerate the harsh environment of space

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then come back and find applications and

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extreme environments on the ground hi

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this is more of a political question

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than a science question with um with our

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government sixteen trillion dollars in

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debt we the government funds NASA and

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you know spends billions of dollars a

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year on it why do you think that on they

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should continue to do that that's a

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great question overall when you look at

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the the federal budget nasa's a very

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small line item in the big picture and

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the the work that is done here is work

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that isn't done anywhere else and does

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have direct applications not to the

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ground you know it's it's fundamental

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science that benefits benefits everybody

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so myself i work in the the aerospace

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industry i'm an advocate for the

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aerospace industry and I think it's

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money well spent I definitely agree

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you're right it certainly is a lot of

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money to an individual like us but in

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like Dan said in the big picture you

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really don't spend a lot on NASA itself

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less than one percent of the national

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budget and I think we get a lot of bang

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for the buck out of it hi I was

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wondering like in the event of emergency

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on the space station like like running

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out of food or not being a lyga backs

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earth does NASA have any like fly

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ends in the case of emergency like that

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there are contingent there are plans and

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place the cover for just about every

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conceivable contingency that the crew

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would encounter with regard to two

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critical consumable items like food and

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water there is a reserve that's

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maintained it usually varies between 45

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and 90 days that if the crew were cut

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off or if there was a resupply slip

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there are spares pre-positioned to

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sustain the crew during that that that

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launch delay and there are evacuation

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plans that are in place that if a

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critical life-support system were to be

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compromised there there are plans to get

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the crew safely back to the ground the

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woman previously talked to us said that

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occasionally or occasionally but

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astronauts are astronauts and training

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have to train for evacuation plans if

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they actually had to evacuate the space

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station of just for something then they

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couldn't get to the right landing area

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where they land well they're actually

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they're basically their lifeboats are

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the Soyuz vehicles that they came to

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earth in or came to the space station in

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so they would just get back to those and

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get out of the space station and undock

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from the space station and use those to

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land in where they actually land in

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Kazakhstan so it's a big desert area

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there's plenty of room for them to land

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and they would have time once they got

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away from the space station to kind of

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plan their landing and make sure they

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ended up in the right place specifically

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how did you choose your career and what

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steps did you have to take to become

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part of NASA uh interesting question

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because I didn't really choose my career

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it chose me to some extent when I

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started off in college I actually wanted

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to be a physical therapist and was

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taking a lot of biology courses are

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trying to take a lot of biology courses

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that I got blocked out of and my advisor

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at the time told me that I might as well

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take chemistry because that was going to

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be

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requirement as well I started taking my

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chemistry sequences through college and

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ended up taking an instrumental analysis

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and quantitative quantitative analysis

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class my freshman year which really

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exposed me for the first time to using

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instrumentation to make kind of chemical

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measurements and character as different

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materials and that just really intrigued

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me and I stuck with it from there once I

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got my undergraduate degree I went on to

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get a PhD at Iowa State up in ames and

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the professor that I worked for at Iowa

355
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State was working on a NASA research

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grant to develop water quality

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monitoring systems for the space station

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so while I was in grad school I started

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working on that project and was able to

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directly transition that to my job down

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here Jesse I think you hear that from a

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lot of the engineers and scientists who

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work at NASA and I've also you know

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talked with astronauts about that before

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as well they all say that what you

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should do is find something that you

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love doing so that you will be inspired

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to be good at it and then that will help

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you end up where you want to go which

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hopefully could be NASA and for myself

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you know I I work in the public affairs

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office at NASA and started out as a

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newspaper reporter and and and finding

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even though I never intended to use it

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the science classes that I took when I

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was in high school in college are really

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helpful for me now and kind of knowing

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what the scientists and engineers are

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talking about would you be able to

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explain how the moisture system works in

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the system which moisture system aren't

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00:16:07,569 --> 00:16:05,389
you mean the waste collection system on

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00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:07,579
the space station that that recycles

384
00:16:14,180 --> 00:16:12,829
yeah that the know that takes the

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00:16:17,139 --> 00:16:14,190
moisture out of the air so it gives the

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00:16:19,160 --> 00:16:17,149
astronauts water yeah so what we have

387
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there's two components to the water

388
00:16:24,259 --> 00:16:21,720
recovery you do have condensing heat

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00:16:25,639 --> 00:16:24,269
exchangers so these are actually very

390
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similar to what you have in commercial

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and residential air conditioning units

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on the ground where water condenses on

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the surface of these heat exchangers

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it's then drawn into the water processor

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assembly that that atmospheric

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condensate that's collected is combined

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with this lit from the urine processor

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00:16:48,079 --> 00:16:46,290
assembly to provide the feedstock for

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00:16:50,630 --> 00:16:48,089
the water processor the water processor

400
00:16:54,470 --> 00:16:50,640
itself uses a combination of processes

401
00:16:57,069 --> 00:16:54,480
to polish that combination of distillate

402
00:17:01,190 --> 00:16:57,079
and common sight back into potable water

403
00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:01,200
it uses high temperature oxidation ion

404
00:17:06,380 --> 00:17:03,570
exchange there's some some carbon sorban

405
00:17:09,020 --> 00:17:06,390
beds and then the final step before the

406
00:17:11,350 --> 00:17:09,030
the water goes into the storage tank for

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00:17:14,179 --> 00:17:11,360
to supply the crew is addition of a

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00:17:15,710 --> 00:17:14,189
biocide which we use molecular iodine in

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00:17:17,630 --> 00:17:15,720
the u.s. segment of the space of the

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00:17:19,010 --> 00:17:17,640
space station and what that does is

411
00:17:21,949 --> 00:17:19,020
inhibits bacterial growth while the

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00:17:24,439 --> 00:17:21,959
waters being stored on the space station

413
00:17:25,669 --> 00:17:24,449
how are we is it simpler on earth for

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00:17:29,510 --> 00:17:25,679
people in third world countries without

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00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:29,520
water is it similar to what people in

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00:17:34,940 --> 00:17:31,530
third world countries could use is that

417
00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:39,860
the the overall processes that we use on

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00:17:43,610 --> 00:17:42,210
the space station to recover water yes

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00:17:47,660 --> 00:17:43,620
are the same processes that you would

420
00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:47,670
use on the ground to take water or any

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00:17:51,830 --> 00:17:49,890
contaminated water support water source

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and bring it back to it to a state that

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could be safe for for human consumption

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of course with NASA the specific systems

425
00:18:02,930 --> 00:18:00,990
that we employ are purpose-built to

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00:18:05,330 --> 00:18:02,940
operate in space so there wouldn't

427
00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:05,340
necessarily be the best answer for a

428
00:18:10,340 --> 00:18:07,770
third world country the they're also

429
00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:10,350
built the sustained six crew at a time

430
00:18:14,420 --> 00:18:12,810
not a village of hundreds of people but

431
00:18:16,820 --> 00:18:14,430
the basic principles behind water

432
00:18:18,860 --> 00:18:16,830
recovery are exactly the same and we

433
00:18:20,330 --> 00:18:18,870
have engineers who work on the the water

434
00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:20,340
recovery systems that we use in space

435
00:18:23,810 --> 00:18:22,170
you also volunteer their time to build

436
00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:23,820
systems that can work in third-world

437
00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:26,250
countries and go out and help build them

438
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:28,170
in the third world countries on in some

439
00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:30,090
occasions and teach people how to use

440
00:18:35,390 --> 00:18:33,090
them Thorin ventilation process with the

441
00:18:38,120 --> 00:18:35,400
water when you you only take out the h2o

442
00:18:40,700 --> 00:18:38,130
and take out everything else or you

443
00:18:42,530 --> 00:18:40,710
separate hton nutrients needed for our

444
00:18:47,390 --> 00:18:42,540
body and dispose of the acids and

445
00:18:51,770 --> 00:18:47,400
chemicals from our from our systems with

446
00:18:53,380 --> 00:18:51,780
the so with the condensing heat

447
00:18:56,060 --> 00:18:53,390
exchangers you actually condensed water

448
00:18:58,100 --> 00:18:56,070
along with any volatile organic

449
00:18:59,750 --> 00:18:58,110
compounds that could be present along

450
00:19:01,280 --> 00:18:59,760
with some dissolved minerals that may be

451
00:19:04,220 --> 00:19:01,290
present in tiny micro droplets of water

452
00:19:05,750 --> 00:19:04,230
that exists and there's there are

453
00:19:07,790 --> 00:19:05,760
metabolic components that come from the

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00:19:10,670 --> 00:19:07,800
crew living and exercising in space that

455
00:19:13,130 --> 00:19:10,680
you condensed in that in that moisture

456
00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:13,140
when you go through the the water

457
00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:15,810
recovery process a lot of those

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00:19:21,980 --> 00:19:17,970
contaminants are either broken down in

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the in the catalytic reactor which is

460
00:19:25,070 --> 00:19:23,370
the oxidation unit they're actually

461
00:19:27,050 --> 00:19:25,080
broken down to co2 and bicarbonate and

462
00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:27,060
then scrubbed out using ion exchange

463
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:29,490
beds in the urine processor assembly

464
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when we're distilling the urine and

465
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bringing over the distillate there's

466
00:19:38,900 --> 00:19:36,620
actually a brine left that's a

467
00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:38,910
concentrated high ionic strength

468
00:19:44,430 --> 00:19:41,970
solution that's discarded in the the

469
00:19:47,550 --> 00:19:44,440
progress vehicles and burned up

470
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oh so makes because they said it's pure

471
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than the water that we have today and we

472
00:19:55,070 --> 00:19:53,110
use just like similar nutrients to make

473
00:19:57,720 --> 00:19:55,080
sure our ward is cleaner so you use more

474
00:19:59,640 --> 00:19:57,730
concentrated once you're saying then no

475
00:20:01,590 --> 00:19:59,650
the the water that the the water that's

476
00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:01,600
produced on the space station is ultra

477
00:20:06,630 --> 00:20:04,450
pure water it is much much cleaner than

478
00:20:10,940 --> 00:20:06,640
than the water that most of us have

479
00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:10,950
access to in the taps in our house the

480
00:20:17,820 --> 00:20:13,450
what you need to remember is that in a

481
00:20:20,940 --> 00:20:17,830
on earth the water supply contains a lot

482
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:20,950
of runoff from agriculture and Industry

483
00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:22,930
that adds contaminants into the water

484
00:20:26,430 --> 00:20:25,090
that have to be removed with much more

485
00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:26,440
difficult processes on the space station

486
00:20:30,690 --> 00:20:29,290
we're fortunate in that the number of

487
00:20:32,940 --> 00:20:30,700
contaminants that we have to deal with

488
00:20:34,740 --> 00:20:32,950
are fairly limited because it's a

489
00:20:36,780 --> 00:20:34,750
closed-loop environment we're not using

490
00:20:38,220 --> 00:20:36,790
fertilizers we don't have large

491
00:20:40,860 --> 00:20:38,230
industrial or large industrial

492
00:20:43,980 --> 00:20:40,870
operations or agricultural operations so

493
00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:43,990
we're really dealing with the metabolic

494
00:20:48,060 --> 00:20:45,850
load from the from the astronauts and

495
00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:48,070
then some of the off-gas and components

496
00:20:51,180 --> 00:20:49,330
from the materials and the products that

497
00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:51,190
they use in space another good reason to

498
00:20:56,640 --> 00:20:52,570
be an astronaut right you get cleaner

499
00:21:01,690 --> 00:20:56,650
water absolutely and you get to drink

500
00:21:05,470 --> 00:21:04,060
I think that's about all the questions

501
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:05,480
we have time for at this time thank you

502
00:21:09,279 --> 00:21:08,090
so much dan for joining us and we really

503
00:21:10,750 --> 00:21:09,289
appreciate you taking the time to answer

504
00:21:12,549 --> 00:21:10,760
some of these questions with us and

505
00:21:14,769 --> 00:21:12,559
thanks so much to the students we enjoy

506
00:21:16,210 --> 00:21:14,779
talking with you hope we were helpful

507
00:21:18,250 --> 00:21:16,220
and were able to answer a lot of your